Outlaw Bible of American Poetry

The American Dissident
A Literary Journal of Critical Thinking
In the Samizdat Tradition of Writing against the Machine
A Forum for Examining the Dark Side of the Academic/Literary Industrial Complex

Unauthorized Interview: Theron and Todd Moore, editors of St. Vitus's Dance
Les éloges ont un parfum que l'on réserve pour embaumer les morts. [Praise has a perfume that ought be reserved for embauming the dead.]
—Voltaire

From a son's point of view, it's great to work with your dad, but from a writing perspective, it's pretty incredible to be working with someone of his caliber and stature in the small press world.
—Theron Moore

The following exchange stems from actual verbatim statements obtained from email correspondence. There is no attempt to create false implications at all. A review by Tony Moffeit, which appeared in Small Press Review (Jan/Feb?) 2007, appears under the cartoon to the right. It is a sorry example of blind hagiographic worship.

The AD— Why are you pushing the inane myth of poets as outlaws?

Todd Moore— Because if you are a poet in America you are also an outlaw. It can't be helped it just happens.

The AD— What about the mob of Glucks, Pinskys, Heaneys, Muldoons, Doves, Angelous, Locklins, Brodskys, and Lifshins?

Todd Moore— When i say outlaw poet, i'm talking about people whose work is not welcome in college or university magazines or presses. The "because if you are a poet in amerika" statement was really relating to small press poets and I made a mistake not specifying that.

The AD— Still, the mass of small press poets are anything but outlaws. Most embrace the system, most do not criticize it, at least not when doing so might entail risk. Lyn Lifshin is certainly cashing in on all fronts. So did Bukowski. And there are no doubt many others, including Locklin.

Todd Moore— But, if the culture nut was cracked in this country and the wrong people decided the intelligentsia somehow constituted a threat, every poet—large press or small press—would be lined up against a wall and shot.

The AD— I think you’re just trying to bolster your own ego and importance with such statements. You are no more a danger to the system, than Pinsky. You mention the “very best of poets” a number of times. But what does that mean? What criteria have you set up to make such a determination? What is a very best poem? It becomes your opinion and nothing else. Yet when you make the statement it comes off as if entirely objective.

Todd Moore— [No comment.] Anyway, i'm always open to criticism and dialogue.

The AD— I suppose I differ from you regarding the pushing of NAMES. I'm against it. It always results in FAME GAME. I'd much rather push a poem, than a poet. Poetry has been sucked into the corporate-celebrity game. It's deplorable. Small press poets today seem to be striving desperately not so much to create a nice poem but to become KNOWN… and often at cost to integrity. Backslapping is part of the process. You slap mine, I'll slap yours, and maybe we'll both become KNOWN.

Todd Moore— yeah, poetry's a game. no argument there. i think you and i pretty much agree on that score. me, i guess i see Locklin and Bukowski in a different light. Locklin gets the readings but he's welcome to them.

The AD— Of course, Locklin is welcome to them—he doesn't make waves. AND that is not what poesy is supposed to be about… that is, if you go back to Villon, Rimbaud, Jeffers, and even Bukowski. WAVES ought be made in poetry… and not just style-wise.

Todd Moore— At one point I suppose i had some big arguments with the world of poetry. Now, all I really care about is working the poem.

The AD— If only poets would be something more than "working the poem." My dream is an army of poet activists injected with the courage to speak truth to power, both small and large. It seems to me things have gotten worse and worse, more corporo-aca-demonised, suit-and-tie poesy than ever before. So, why the end of your "big arguments"?

Todd Moore— [No comment]

The AD— So, uh Theron, what do you think about corruption in literature, etc.?

Theron Moore— I guess one word: CORRUPTION. Plain and simple. Always has been always will.

The AD— Your implication is accept it. That's what THEY want you to do.

Theron Moore— You definitely hold some pretty strong viewpoints re: the state of modern poetry, the small press world, etc., how about considering writing an essay for SVD on this? If we are indeed the enemy for which you perceive us to be, why not sneak across enemy lines and get your viewpoint out there? I would really welcome that. Rail and rant and basically just hold the small press world, the state of modern poetry, etc. under a microscope and criticize and dissect and destroy and go for it! Put yourself on the line (outside of your web-site and magazine of course) see where it ends up. [Then a few days later out of the blue…] My father and I have mutually agreed to retract the offer of accepting an essay by you for print in the next issue. We're also requesting that future e-mail exchanges between you and myself, and my father and you be terminated as well. Thank you for your time.